Pretty much I want to buy a 1080P display and external speakers; but without paying for internal speakers/tuners that I'm not going to use. I want the display to look great, so I'm worried about buying a display which is flawed or that I'm not looking enough into other characteristics outside of resolution. I also am at a total loss for speaker selection, I just want some serious quality there, and not some tinny integrated airwaves. I want to think the money I'm spending is all going into exactly what I want to use it for, without any bells or whistles.
I don't watch TV; it's not my thing, so I don't care about the tuner. (If, somehow, a TV was better looking and cheaper than a speakerless monitor of the same caliber, I'd head in that direction. It doesn't logically add up to me - but I wouldn't be on this forum if I didn't expect to be told I'm wrong!)
I'm also looking to shell out on some actual speakers, too, so if the best display is just a monitor and thus, has no speakers, I'm already cool with that. My problem there is that I don't know what to do about my HDMI cable, which will go directly into the display, leaving nothing left to hook into the speakers. I think there's ways around it, but I think they need to be considered WHILE choosing the speakers and display.
Honestly, I know nothing of audio. I just find it awesome when it all works out - I want to get into that. I'm not looking to run wires everywhere - I'm certainly not handy and cringe at the appearance of cruddy wiring jobs I've seen, but I thought a couple of towers for speakers might have decent aesthetic and still give some decent quality. I'm really open on this - what say you?
What speakers can still work, even if the monitor eats up the ps3's HDMI cable; assuming I buy whatever cables/other equipment necessary for the solution.
Overall, I'm looking for near the state of the art, right where it's all great notch, but right before the advances in tech start making those exponential leaps in price.
My roommate's not going anywhere until June/July, and I've got a small, tinny TV which could easily hold me over for months if it needed to, something I'd be fine with if you think there's some advance in tech or major drop in price or both coming to the market this year. Black Friday?
Ultimately, what's the best way to go here for something I'm going to use for a long while and remain satisfied with? I feel like I'm being pretty picky, so thanks for digesting all of this. Any feedback on any or all of these concerns would be great ~
-Kando
Reply 1 : PS3 HD display/audio for somewhat niche user
Time for a facts of life discussion I can see.
First off, with the TV, response rate, viewing angle, and contrast ratio are the primary things you want to look for. Don't get suckered in by all this 240Hz garbage, since it's a bunch of funny math how they get to that figure anyway. Look for the response rate. This is how fast any given pixel can change from black to white (all other colors are somewhere between those two). THAT will have the biggest impact on the overall fluidity of the image. Viewing angle should be pretty self-explanatory. It's mostly good for a tie breaker sort of thing. If two TV sets are identical in pretty much every way, but one has a bigger viewing angle, then go for that one. Contrast ratio is also important, since that basically tells you the range of colors the TV is capable of displaying.
HOWEVER, and I really cannot stress this enough, DO NOT buy a TV without having seen it for yourself first. Not all display panels used in TVs are created equal. So some TV set may look really good on Amazon, but if you compared it to some others with seemingly lesser specs, it would be blown out of the water. You can certainly buy the TV off a place like Amazon AFTER you've seen it in a store, but on physically large items, and also big ticket type items, buying from a local retail store is generally the better option. If something's wrong with the thing, it's far less hassle to take it back. Some place like Amazon, you'll probably have to eat about $50 just shipping it back to them, then waiting a week or two to get a replacement. Local retail you'll be in, out, and done probably within the hour.
Now, onto the audio part of things, where basically you will absolutely need some kind of a receiver. There's just no getting around this if you're planning to use HDMI for video. You could potentially go component video, but then you still only have composite audio, and it sounds like you want the full experience with this. If you want the full surround sound experience the PS3 is capable of (and on games like FFXIII where it's mixed in full surround sound, it sounds AWESOME), you absolutely need a receiver, and you probably shouldn't skimp on this either.
Everyone has their favorite brand, Onkyo has always served me well, but plenty of people speak highly of Yamaha and even Sony. Point is, you want a receiver capable of 7.2 audio. Even if you only end up going with stereo speakers, you may as well have the potential for the full surround sound experience if you decide later on you want that. And good luck finding a receiver that doesn't do at least 5.1 these days. But if you're going to use HDMI for video, then the PS3 is going to send the audio signal over HDMI as well, and take it from someone who's tried a bunch of alternate solutions, a receiver is both cheaper, easier to set up, and gives far superior sound quality.
Now, when you're looking for speakers, you want to look primarily at the frequency range. The bigger the range the better. That means that they will be able to more accurately represent sounds, and they won't come off sounding tinny or hollow. You want at least 2-way speakers, 3-way is better. The number of "ways" refers to the number of speakers in each speaker assembly. A 2-way speaker typically has the main speaker and a tweeter for high frequency sounds. A 3-way speaker tends to add a small subwoofer to the speaker -- as well as a tweeter -- for lower frequency sounds. A good sub can help make up for this, but the broader the range of frequencies the speakers themselves can handle the better, since the sub is only one giant speaker. The physical size of the speaker does play some part in things, since it's easier to put bigger, more powerful, magnets in a larger housing, but pay more attention to frequency range and the number of ways a speaker is.
The subwoofer is kind of a matter of taste. Some people like big booming bass, others are like me, and like to hear something OTHER than the thudding of the sub. Again, frequency range is key. You'd be surprised at the subtle impact a good sub can have on sound quality. If you like the big booming sounds, get a sub with a lot of watts behind it.
But again, as I've already mentioned, make sure you factor into your budget the cost of a good receiver. This is going to be an unavoidable component of your setup unless you want to use the crappy speakers in the TV.
First off, with the TV, response rate, viewing angle, and contrast ratio are the primary things you want to look for. Don't get suckered in by all this 240Hz garbage, since it's a bunch of funny math how they get to that figure anyway. Look for the response rate. This is how fast any given pixel can change from black to white (all other colors are somewhere between those two). THAT will have the biggest impact on the overall fluidity of the image. Viewing angle should be pretty self-explanatory. It's mostly good for a tie breaker sort of thing. If two TV sets are identical in pretty much every way, but one has a bigger viewing angle, then go for that one. Contrast ratio is also important, since that basically tells you the range of colors the TV is capable of displaying.
HOWEVER, and I really cannot stress this enough, DO NOT buy a TV without having seen it for yourself first. Not all display panels used in TVs are created equal. So some TV set may look really good on Amazon, but if you compared it to some others with seemingly lesser specs, it would be blown out of the water. You can certainly buy the TV off a place like Amazon AFTER you've seen it in a store, but on physically large items, and also big ticket type items, buying from a local retail store is generally the better option. If something's wrong with the thing, it's far less hassle to take it back. Some place like Amazon, you'll probably have to eat about $50 just shipping it back to them, then waiting a week or two to get a replacement. Local retail you'll be in, out, and done probably within the hour.
Now, onto the audio part of things, where basically you will absolutely need some kind of a receiver. There's just no getting around this if you're planning to use HDMI for video. You could potentially go component video, but then you still only have composite audio, and it sounds like you want the full experience with this. If you want the full surround sound experience the PS3 is capable of (and on games like FFXIII where it's mixed in full surround sound, it sounds AWESOME), you absolutely need a receiver, and you probably shouldn't skimp on this either.
Everyone has their favorite brand, Onkyo has always served me well, but plenty of people speak highly of Yamaha and even Sony. Point is, you want a receiver capable of 7.2 audio. Even if you only end up going with stereo speakers, you may as well have the potential for the full surround sound experience if you decide later on you want that. And good luck finding a receiver that doesn't do at least 5.1 these days. But if you're going to use HDMI for video, then the PS3 is going to send the audio signal over HDMI as well, and take it from someone who's tried a bunch of alternate solutions, a receiver is both cheaper, easier to set up, and gives far superior sound quality.
Now, when you're looking for speakers, you want to look primarily at the frequency range. The bigger the range the better. That means that they will be able to more accurately represent sounds, and they won't come off sounding tinny or hollow. You want at least 2-way speakers, 3-way is better. The number of "ways" refers to the number of speakers in each speaker assembly. A 2-way speaker typically has the main speaker and a tweeter for high frequency sounds. A 3-way speaker tends to add a small subwoofer to the speaker -- as well as a tweeter -- for lower frequency sounds. A good sub can help make up for this, but the broader the range of frequencies the speakers themselves can handle the better, since the sub is only one giant speaker. The physical size of the speaker does play some part in things, since it's easier to put bigger, more powerful, magnets in a larger housing, but pay more attention to frequency range and the number of ways a speaker is.
The subwoofer is kind of a matter of taste. Some people like big booming bass, others are like me, and like to hear something OTHER than the thudding of the sub. Again, frequency range is key. You'd be surprised at the subtle impact a good sub can have on sound quality. If you like the big booming sounds, get a sub with a lot of watts behind it.
But again, as I've already mentioned, make sure you factor into your budget the cost of a good receiver. This is going to be an unavoidable component of your setup unless you want to use the crappy speakers in the TV.
Reply 2 : PS3 HD display/audio for somewhat niche user
Going from what you've said, I've got a few more questions~
Is there a chart somewhere that compares all the current monitors by specs, that I could compare what's out there side by side according to response times, viewing angles, and contrast ratios, and obviously res? I'd like to go into a retail store and have a couple models in mind when I get there, or at least see what the ranges and averages are as rules of thumb for these values. What's typical?, what's above average?, etcetera. (Do you have any pointers for these vales?)
7.2 noted and a go-go on the receiver, but I've got more questions about a receiver in general. How will the receiver work? If I connect the HDMI from the PS3 to the monitor, what will I connect to the audio receiver? Or will I buy an AV receiver and connect the HDMI from the PS3 to the receiver and then another HDMI from the receiver to the monitor? If that's the case, I'll need 2 HDMI cables; will I need any special cables for the audio? Will it just be the red/black wires I've caught a glimpse of in other people's homes?
As a side note, what do you think of wireless speakers? Is there loss in quality due to the lack of a hard line? I'm typically skeptical of wireless, especially because of the possibility of this notion, but it is nice to not run lines everywhere if I do go surround ... (you made a pretty presentable case, haha.) Either way, large 3-ways don't seem so bad at all. Any pointers if I did go surround?
I'm with you entirely when you say you're nonplussed by large woofs just for a large thud, so I think I'm in agreement with your tastes. Are you saying, however, that a sub with a large frequency range is entirely worth it? For speakers and subs and tweets, what constitutes as necessity (wouldn't want to go below this point) for frequency ranges? Like the displays, I can compare prices between shifts in specs, but I want to make sure I'm not stinting in a certain category without knowing it.
This is really helpful, all-forms; thanks again, Jim
Is there a chart somewhere that compares all the current monitors by specs, that I could compare what's out there side by side according to response times, viewing angles, and contrast ratios, and obviously res? I'd like to go into a retail store and have a couple models in mind when I get there, or at least see what the ranges and averages are as rules of thumb for these values. What's typical?, what's above average?, etcetera. (Do you have any pointers for these vales?)
7.2 noted and a go-go on the receiver, but I've got more questions about a receiver in general. How will the receiver work? If I connect the HDMI from the PS3 to the monitor, what will I connect to the audio receiver? Or will I buy an AV receiver and connect the HDMI from the PS3 to the receiver and then another HDMI from the receiver to the monitor? If that's the case, I'll need 2 HDMI cables; will I need any special cables for the audio? Will it just be the red/black wires I've caught a glimpse of in other people's homes?
As a side note, what do you think of wireless speakers? Is there loss in quality due to the lack of a hard line? I'm typically skeptical of wireless, especially because of the possibility of this notion, but it is nice to not run lines everywhere if I do go surround ... (you made a pretty presentable case, haha.) Either way, large 3-ways don't seem so bad at all. Any pointers if I did go surround?
I'm with you entirely when you say you're nonplussed by large woofs just for a large thud, so I think I'm in agreement with your tastes. Are you saying, however, that a sub with a large frequency range is entirely worth it? For speakers and subs and tweets, what constitutes as necessity (wouldn't want to go below this point) for frequency ranges? Like the displays, I can compare prices between shifts in specs, but I want to make sure I'm not stinting in a certain category without knowing it.
This is really helpful, all-forms; thanks again, Jim
Reply 3 : PS3 HD display/audio for somewhat niche user
It's unlikely there's any such site, so you'll have to do this in stages. Go to a couple local stores (with Circuit City going out of business it kind of reduces your options) like Best Buy, Fry's if there's one in your area, and even places like Walmart, Target, Sears/K-Mart. Write down the EXACT model name of any set that looks interesting to you, and then take that list home and start typing them into Google (or your preferred search engine) with something like "reviews" at the end. You can check Amazon, NewEgg, and even Cnet to see if they either sell that same set or have a review up. You should be able to get a detailed list of the specs from sites like NewEgg or Amazon, and also some user reviews. Odds are the reviews will help you knock at least a couple sets off your list because they'll be universally bad.
The resolution part don't worry about, because HDTVs only have 3 resolutions: 640x480 (480p), 1280x720 (720p), and 1920x1080 (1080p). Doesn't matter how big the screen size is, maximum resolution is going to be 1920x1080. The only thing that changes is either the size of the individual pixels or the space between them.
As for the rest... All other things equal, wider viewing angles, lower response rates, and higher contrast ratios are what you want to go for. The higher or lower the better, depending on the metric. Honestly, I have a pretty standard 32" 1080p set and it works just fine for all my gaming needs. I don't play a lot of FPS type games, what I play is probably a lot closer to WoW than a FPS, so I would imagine virtually any TV will be fine. But obviously if it comes down to 2-3 sets, and it's a tossup on the major factors like price and display quality, lower response rates, wider viewing angles, and higher contrast ratios should help pick a winner.
On to the audio side of things...
Any HDMI capable receiver will have what's known as HDMI passthrough abilities. So you'd take the HDMI cable from your PS3, plug it into the receiver, and it would then strip out just the audio portion sending the video on to the TV through another HDMI cable. Some higher end receivers can even do signal conversion, so you could take an HDMI input and have the output be component video or even composite. Or the other way around, so let's say you decided to get a Wii some day, which only has component video, you could take that component video, and have the receiver send the output signal over HDMI. A lot of this stuff will be a lot easier to figure out when you have the actual receiver in front of you, assuming you can think in a fairly logical way.
As for wireless speakers, I've never used them, so it would really probably depend on what kind of wireless tech they're using. If it's some kind of Ir based setup, run for the hills. You have a friend over, and they need to use the bathroom or something, it might cause one speaker to cut out momentarily as they broke the line of sight. If it's some kind of RF signal, then you'd have to be aware of things like cordless phones, wireless routers, etc. Those could potentially cause interference depending on their respective frequencies. So, while you should probably take this with a grain of salt, since I've never personally used them, I'd say that they should be lumped in with most wireless networking. Better in theory than practice. Do like with the TVs, and check some of the reviews for them on sites like NewEgg and Amazon. If some set has hundreds, even thousands, of largely positive reviews, then you can probably assume they'll work well.
And subs also do what is called LFE (Low Frequency Effects) which really more than anything helps create the sound field that creates the surround sound illusion. Think of it like a person who can throw their voice. The more precise the sub is, the better it can make it really sound like there's some explosion happening right behind you. The better it can compliment the sounds coming from any individual speaker, the more realistic the sound. And obviously a sub is only one speaker, so can only generate one frequency tone at any given moment, which is why 3-way speakers can make a difference. Each speaker having something of a dedicated sub can help make up for some of the limitations of the main sub. They're not a replacement, but more an augmentation.
Again, this is an all other things being equal. Get the sub and speakers with the greatest frequency range that you can afford, and do a little cost-benefit analysis of your own. It's probably not worth paying 1.5-2X more for a speaker and sub set that has an extra 4-5Hz range for example. If it's only an extra $50, and you can afford the $50, then maybe.
Like any major purchase, the research phase takes a long time if you want to do it right. You need to become something of an expert in your own right. Lucky for you, you have at least 2-3 months to wrap your head around all of this and you can even get started on the TV end of things now. Hit some local stores, see what there is to see, and start looking for reviews.
And I will say that one thing I like about Onkyo is their Club Onkyo site where they sell refurb units. They're labeled as refurb, and so they say may contain missing cables or have minor cosmetic damage, but I think 90% of the stuff is just models they've discontinued and are looking to clear out of their warehouses, so they sell them at a discount. I've bought two off of them, both looked like they could have come right from a retail store. One had a bum IR sensor, but Onkyo's CS dept got me set up with a replacement pretty quickly and painlessly. But don't buy an Onkyo just because that's what I've used. Look around, read reviews, make a decision based on what you think sounds good.
The resolution part don't worry about, because HDTVs only have 3 resolutions: 640x480 (480p), 1280x720 (720p), and 1920x1080 (1080p). Doesn't matter how big the screen size is, maximum resolution is going to be 1920x1080. The only thing that changes is either the size of the individual pixels or the space between them.
As for the rest... All other things equal, wider viewing angles, lower response rates, and higher contrast ratios are what you want to go for. The higher or lower the better, depending on the metric. Honestly, I have a pretty standard 32" 1080p set and it works just fine for all my gaming needs. I don't play a lot of FPS type games, what I play is probably a lot closer to WoW than a FPS, so I would imagine virtually any TV will be fine. But obviously if it comes down to 2-3 sets, and it's a tossup on the major factors like price and display quality, lower response rates, wider viewing angles, and higher contrast ratios should help pick a winner.
On to the audio side of things...
Any HDMI capable receiver will have what's known as HDMI passthrough abilities. So you'd take the HDMI cable from your PS3, plug it into the receiver, and it would then strip out just the audio portion sending the video on to the TV through another HDMI cable. Some higher end receivers can even do signal conversion, so you could take an HDMI input and have the output be component video or even composite. Or the other way around, so let's say you decided to get a Wii some day, which only has component video, you could take that component video, and have the receiver send the output signal over HDMI. A lot of this stuff will be a lot easier to figure out when you have the actual receiver in front of you, assuming you can think in a fairly logical way.
As for wireless speakers, I've never used them, so it would really probably depend on what kind of wireless tech they're using. If it's some kind of Ir based setup, run for the hills. You have a friend over, and they need to use the bathroom or something, it might cause one speaker to cut out momentarily as they broke the line of sight. If it's some kind of RF signal, then you'd have to be aware of things like cordless phones, wireless routers, etc. Those could potentially cause interference depending on their respective frequencies. So, while you should probably take this with a grain of salt, since I've never personally used them, I'd say that they should be lumped in with most wireless networking. Better in theory than practice. Do like with the TVs, and check some of the reviews for them on sites like NewEgg and Amazon. If some set has hundreds, even thousands, of largely positive reviews, then you can probably assume they'll work well.
And subs also do what is called LFE (Low Frequency Effects) which really more than anything helps create the sound field that creates the surround sound illusion. Think of it like a person who can throw their voice. The more precise the sub is, the better it can make it really sound like there's some explosion happening right behind you. The better it can compliment the sounds coming from any individual speaker, the more realistic the sound. And obviously a sub is only one speaker, so can only generate one frequency tone at any given moment, which is why 3-way speakers can make a difference. Each speaker having something of a dedicated sub can help make up for some of the limitations of the main sub. They're not a replacement, but more an augmentation.
Again, this is an all other things being equal. Get the sub and speakers with the greatest frequency range that you can afford, and do a little cost-benefit analysis of your own. It's probably not worth paying 1.5-2X more for a speaker and sub set that has an extra 4-5Hz range for example. If it's only an extra $50, and you can afford the $50, then maybe.
Like any major purchase, the research phase takes a long time if you want to do it right. You need to become something of an expert in your own right. Lucky for you, you have at least 2-3 months to wrap your head around all of this and you can even get started on the TV end of things now. Hit some local stores, see what there is to see, and start looking for reviews.
And I will say that one thing I like about Onkyo is their Club Onkyo site where they sell refurb units. They're labeled as refurb, and so they say may contain missing cables or have minor cosmetic damage, but I think 90% of the stuff is just models they've discontinued and are looking to clear out of their warehouses, so they sell them at a discount. I've bought two off of them, both looked like they could have come right from a retail store. One had a bum IR sensor, but Onkyo's CS dept got me set up with a replacement pretty quickly and painlessly. But don't buy an Onkyo just because that's what I've used. Look around, read reviews, make a decision based on what you think sounds good.
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